Aquadefense is approved by IAPMO for use as a shower pan liner, but be sure to check your local building codes, as some areas of the country still require the PVC liner. Modified thin-set mortars must dry for the polymers to coalesce and form a hard . Can I put Kerdi board over drywall? They are absorbed into the surface material and help keep moisture away from the substrate surface. Personally, I like standard drywall. When it comes to applying KERDI, however, it is advised to use a regular thinset that includes portland cement as its main component. It also features fleece webbing that allows for effective anchoring into thin-set mortar. Sure, you can do it.just be sure to "spritz" or wet the hardi thoroughly before.it's pretty "thirsty.". . If he did the framing for the shower, then in order to measure for it correctly, he would need to know how thick the tile is so that he can avoid exactly this problem. MAPEI makes products for each step of the remodel process, giving you a single source solution, and only one phone number to call if you need assistance! rev2023.3.3.43278. However, a cement board is generally easier and less expensive to replace if a repair is needed. builder, anti-builder, rebuilder -- Retired Moderator. I'm guessing he put a 2x6 across for the curb? It only takes a minute to sign up. Thanks for contributing an answer to Home Improvement Stack Exchange! LONDON. I want to mount a cast iron bathtub, but not pull down my 1905 plaster and lath. He would take his rough opening measurement and subtract the thicknesses of the tile, the cement board, and in his unique install method the purpleboard. Yes, KERDI membrane will stick to cement board. This will help protect the cement board from water damage, and is often a specific type of coating designed for use with cement boards. Porcelain and ceramic tiles are stiff and hard materials, so if they are installed on an unlevel or bouncy surface they are highly susceptible to cracking. Ceramic and porcelain tile, more than almost any other surface material, need a stable . In general, modified thin-set mortar is not recommended to set ceramic and stone tile, including large format tiles, over the KERDI membrane. Water-resistant gypsum board, or green board, was used in the past as a tile backer but is no longer recommended, mainly because better products are available. Here's how to get it right the first time, If you've got a steady hand, a few easy-to-find supplies and patience, you can install a tile backsplash in a kitchen or bathroom, Step 4 in swapping your tub for a sleek new shower: Pick your waterproofing materials and drain, and don't forget to test, Work with your contractors and installers to ensure a safe, stylish curb that keeps the water where it belongs, Get the benefits of a time-honored ritual without firing up the coals, thanks to easier-than-ever home steam systems, Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers, Outdoor Lighting & Audio/Visual Specialists, Out With the Old Tile: 8 Steps to Prep for Demolition, Convert Your Tub Space Into a Shower Waterproofing and Drainage, Steam Showers Bring a Beloved Spa Feature Home. 120 sq feet including the floor. Drywall under Kerdi would have been a better choice. This will help you achieve the best results and ensure the longevity of your project. Cross your fingers and hope it's all OK. Not the best Kerdi Showcase. Hello D Zak! Hang the cement boar. For the floor I make a dry mix mud base and then the Kerdi membrane. It is a fast process that is hard to mess up if you do it right. Plus, if you use the mold and moisture resistant drywall, it will be extra insurance against mold. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. I also used the Kerdi drain. I ended up putting up a thin, skim-coat of thinset all over the hardi board, letting it dry, and then putting up the kerdi. This is a bit difficult to answer as it depends on the particular application for the floor system. It allows you to easily and quickly create tile-ready elements in bathtub surrounds and platforms, vanities, showers, shelving, and much more. It installs with screws, then you tape the joints & screw holes and install your tile. You have to seal every little hole in the floor so the underlayment doesnt seep into spaces below. document.getElementById("ak_js_1").setAttribute("value",(new Date()).getTime()); Your email address will not be published. Hardi is definitely a "thirsty" substrate but will work, even without a primer of RedGard. What can a lawyer do if the client wants him to be acquitted of everything despite serious evidence? For all the substrates listed in this Handbook (e.g., gypsum board, cement backerboard, etc. you should still water proof with a liquid membrane product like RedGuard. Schluter Kerdi 108 Sq Ft Waterproofing Membrane - amazon.com Recovering from a blunder I made while emailing a professor, Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain. . Yeah it seems that the only products that will be compatible with cement board and the kerdi membrane are bostik ditra-set and schluter all-set (or one of schluters other products). It costs more but it;s worth it for the ease of install IMO. Schluter Kerdi on regular drywall - GreenBuildingAdvisor Houzz utilise des cookies et d'autres technologies de suivi similaires pour personnaliser mon exprience utilisateur, me proposer du contenu pertinent et amliorer ses produits et services. With that said, lets take a look at the importance of choosing the right tile substrate, the options you have, and which tile underlayment material you should choose Kerdi Board or cement board? Personnaliser mon exprience l'aide de cookies, Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers, Outdoor Lighting & Audio/Visual Specialists, epoxy or marine paint over greenboard for my shower walls (not tile), Need advice on bathroom remodel - using hardiebacker boards, HELP! Kerdi board is a kind of waterproofer because these kinds of boards are made of XPS foam. Is it ok to fasten a shower surround to Schluter Kerdi curb? Can Kerdi membrane be installed over painted drywall? And second, since it's foam, the board is super easy to cut with just a utility knife. When installation is done properly, Kerdi membrane offers a waterproof barrier that can protect the plywood below from moisture. Well, I'm going to give you three different ways to seal the backer board at the tub flange. This will help to extend its lifespan and make sure it looks its best for years to come. Step 2: Determine the room's center. Allow the primer to dry completely before proceeding with the KERDI installation. If you can avoid that, the demo would be ~easy enough to maybe have some friends who'd work for beer come over and help you knock it out. I usually use Durock. And second, since its foam, the board is super easy to cut with just a utility knife. link to How To Organize A Bathroom Closet. Keep in mind, that, just to be safe, most professionals choose to install a waterproofing membrane on top of the cement board when installing in wet locations like tub surrounds or showers. Thanks Paul! Run a damp towel over the cement board surface to dust . The most important thing to remember when applying the membrane over the cement board is to make sure the surface is clean and free of any debris, dust or other contaminants. When having to put it up on the wall or measure it for size, you will find that you can get the exact measurements you need without much trouble. Should I redo this wall to avoid a mold sandwich? What I would be most scared off is the fact that no inside or outside corners appear to have been used. How long should I wait after painting on the Redgard before I try to reapply the membrane? While cement board may be the most common and widely-known tile substrate, Kerdi Board is giving it a run for its money. x 96 in. When it comes to installation, a Schlter system is typically easier to install than a cement board, and it also allows for more design freedom as it does not require a traditional waterproof layer. Once its cleaned, use caulk to seal all of the seams where the cement board meets the walls. vegan) just to try it, does this inconvenience the caterers and staff? Can you remove tile from Kerdi membrane? Once youre sure that the membrane is completely dry, you can then move forward with tiling. How "tidy" does the kerdi band need to be? It is a topical waterproofing layer that is put over the substrate to keep water from getting to the wood frame and nails. The use of modified thinset adhesive could result in an inadequate bond and could lead to possible delamination. Good luck with your project. Hi.I have a unique situation. Any competent tile contractor would float the wall in mortar giving you a stronger, level, perfectly flat, and square surface to properly install tile. I have to redo my tub surround due to moisture leaks and failing grout. Tile Backer Board Breakdown - DIYTileGuy First, you would waterproof with your favorite liquid waterproofing membrane of . See the foam bench and the corners. Kerdi Questions and Answers - Kennedy Kitchens & Baths Install the drain adapter, if needed. However, you do still have to take care to waterproof the seams and the fastener penetrations to create a waterproof assembly. Kerdi Board vs. Cement Board: What Are The Major Differences? By the time you switch from the RG application to the Kerdi installation, it should be dry. Important to overlap seams in a shingle method. A 1/2-inch thick, 3 x 5 foot sheet weighs just 7-1/2 pounds, compared with 45 pounds for a similar size sheet of cement board. The curb doesn't have to be any wider than a 2x4. Will add it in. RedGard can be applied to cement board panels in two ways: Roll it on the wall with a 3/4-inch nap roller or spray it on the wall. This is confusing since Kerdi Board has no Kerdi on it. Sweeby-Can you clarify- I undestood that the thinset would tend to dry out from the thirsty hardi or skim over from the air; so how does booking the Kerdi help with the first? We are still most comfortable with full plumber's pan over the curb, including glue-on preformed corners, and also a second layer (usually Kerdi but can be paint-on) on top of CBU wrap over curb. How do I align things in the following tabular environment? This creates a strong, waterproof tile backer that also functions as an uncoupling membrane. But I can't give you a +1 because telling someone to mortar all the walls in a large shower is like telling them to make an ice sculpture. This product is available in 3/16", 3/8", 1/2", 5/8" 3/4", 1" 1-1/2" and 2" thicknesses, allowing for a wide variety of installation options. Mike Holmes uses backer on his show. I hope you made the guy flood test his work prior to tiling the shower floor. Will use the Schluter Shower system. Here are the fundamentals of tile installation over cement board. En cliquant sur Accepter , j'accepte l'utilisation des cookies telle qu'elle est dcrite plus en dtail dans la Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. On top of that, fiber cement board is even more brittle than standard cement board, so you have to be extra careful to keep screws at least an inch from the edge to avoid breaking the board. In general, the Schlter system is typically more expensive than a cement board, and some people may find this an attractive option for its long lasting, easy to maintain qualities. There is a product called Kerdiboard you might want to look into. Kerdi Board Vs. Cement Board (What's The Difference?) - Home Mindset All it takes is the right preparation. In jobsite conditions and over a long time, who knows. I used 1/2 Hardibacker board over the studs and then used the Kerdi membrane over the Hardi. They can be installed on any type of support and can even be used to create partitions, with no structural support required. Kerdi vs Redguard cost breakdown. : r/HomeImprovement - reddit This is a very effective and popular method of installing tile, and one that ensures the tile doesnt crack. Glass mat gypsum board is a better choice. By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. If so, that means breaking up the floor pan. The thin-set mortar should be mixed to a fairly dry consistency and then spread on the surface with a 1/4 inch square notch trowel. Kerdi Shower Pan and Cement Board Walls - DIY Home Improvement Forum In the worst case, it's OK to cut the Kerdi, remove the damaged section, scrape up the thinset from the areas, and set a new piece of Kerdi. But a mortar bed does have advantages. Underlayment is designed to smooth out uneven areas of the subfloor and form a rigid layer that prevents the flooring from bending. Another advantage is that the polyisocyanurate core of foam boards is waterproof. Install the Schluter Kerdi membrane over the backer board using the correct mortar. Step 7: Cut the Tile. Kerdi is also used as shower lining, as required in IRC Section P2709.2 and IPC Section 417.5.2, over concrete, mortar, tile backerboard, expanded polystyrene foam board, prefabricated polystyrene shower trays, curb and ramp, gypsum board and masonry substrates." So, you can choose what board you want in your shower when using Kerdi. This allows for future compression and an area at the corner where things are more forgiving. What to use to flatten and prep wall before installing Schluter Kerdi membrane for tiling? 1. Finally, use a roller or brush to ensure that the membrane is secure and has no wrinkles or air bubbles. They are square. Kerdi 3 ft. 3 in. You just need a hammer and wonderbar for the walls. They are designed to provide a waterproof, vapor-tight layer to the substrate, which in this case would be the cement board. Wedi showers feature a pre-sloped base that is already installed. The main issue caused by non-waterproof cement boards is the eventual warping and damage to the tiles, making it difficult and costly to fix without removing all the tile and starting over. Thanks to Mongo's earlier post, we knew we'd have to spritz the Hardi -- but found that even that wasn't quite enough. The thickness of the tile is important, and should be known, but not because it changes the method of building. Cement board sucks up the moisture and as a result, the kerdi doesn't always stick as well to cement board. Kerdi membrane is a waterproofing material that is designed to be used in wet areas such as bathrooms and showers before tiles are installed. Their lighter weight makes moving panels around during installation a cinch, which is a far cry from the heft of conventional cement board. Waterproofing is an important aspect of any bathroom or wet-area installation. Foam-core tile backing board has two big advantages over other backer boards. I hang Kerdi on cement board and fibercement board all the time. We tried adding water to the thinset, we tried . The Kerdi-Line prefab pans and drains make me feel way more comfortable with the waterproofing. And how do you keep too much water from interfering with the adhesion in the second scenario?Thanks!! . Additionally, if the cement board isnt waterproof, it can also cause mold and mildew issues, as well as dry wall damage from the moisture seeping through. It is important to seal any imperfections in the drywall to ensure a long-lasting installation and to minimize water infiltration. You absolutely need to include some sort of substrate (cement board, green board, regular drywall) with the Schluter-Kerdi waterproofing kit. Yes, you need waterproofing behind shower tile. Go with smaller bags or only mix half. Both may be effective substrates, but Kerdi Board boasts significant advantages. Fixing that is not that easy though. Kerdi Membrane Installation (Step-by-Step Installation Guide) I think I'll try using the thinned mixture of Redgard and then try the Kerdi membrane again. The shower is ready for tile. You still use metal lath, but then mix bags of powder and pour the soupy mix onto the floor. On a vertical surface, very little moisture . So long as the seams and joint areas are properly prepared, the panels can also provide waterproofing. Modified vs. Unmodified Mortar With Kerdi Membranes How to follow the signal when reading the schematic? KERDI features a modified polyethylene (PEVA) core with non-woven polypropylene on both sides to anchor the membrane in the thin-set mortar. Kerdi-Board panels allow the installer to prepare and create a broad range . I also used the Kerdi drain. It fell right off? A 1/2-inch thick, 3 x 5 foot sheet weighs just 7-1/2 pounds, compared with 45 pounds for a similar size sheet of cement board. Will use the Schluter Shower system. Waterproof showers are the trend today, so RedGard is an excellent alternative to cement boards that act as vapor barriers. Can you put KERDI over regular drywall? - remodelormove.com Furthermore, if you're working in an older home KERDI-BOARD fits better than cement board in odd spaces. Too little, and the kerdi will never show you gray, no matter how you sweat. Preparing drywall for KERDI membrane requires a few important steps to ensure a successful application. . Required fields are marked *. While cement board is a reliable tile underlayment, it isnt completely waterproof only water-resistant. Step 6: Choosing the Next Tile. Wedi vs. Kerdi Waterproof Membranes: Which Is Better? Je peux rejeter les cookies non essentiels en cliquant sur Grer mes prfrences . GoBoard is a kind of backer board because the main elements of a backer board are cement, silica, fiberglass, etc. Builder saying he doesn't want to put my trim tile in here. We ended up sponging the Hardi and wetting and booking the Kerdi (a la wallpaper), and that made the installation go much smoother. What type of thin-set mortar should I use when installing Schluter-KERDI? I set the Kerdi with my hands, pat it into the thinset with my hands, then go over it with a 4" taping knife held at a low angle to embed the Kerdi in the thinset. How to adhere edge of bullnose tile to drywall as trim for shower/tub surround. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. RedGard, on the other hand, is a liquid waterproofing membrane made by Custom Building Products. HardieBacker with Hydrodefense instead of Kerdi Board? : r/DIY - reddit Kerdi membrane over drywall in shower - qkfb.recidivazero.it Find the website that's made specifically for you. WATCH HERE: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TRLd2HYhbU&list=PLO47JMsdYGrkxM_ZkOc3lMnsVhTqj80bB#justdoityourself #lovingit #p. Additionally, the use of modified thinset with KERDI could lead to cracks and other issues down the line as the modified thinset can shrink and pull away from the KERDI membrane over time. (3ft-3in wide). The colour is different. I look at ceramic tile as a lifetime-of the house-product, so I use the best material for the job.I prefer to use cement board as the substrate with the Kerdi on top.